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An Open Daily Experience An Interview with Wang Gongxin
By Fu Xiaodong
Fu Xiaodong (Fu): You began working on media art two years after you arrived in the USA. Such a change can be seen as a drastic contrast to your previous academic training. What was the process of the change?
Wang Gongxin (Wang): It was a change of the state of mind and lifestyle and was quite complex. When I went to the USA in 1998, I was a visiting scholar of realistic painting. The culture shock triggered the change, and I went through a period of self-subversion and self-denial for about 2 to 3 years. Everything started from zero again. But thanks to my techniques of realistic painting, I was able to survive in the USA. What influenced me the most was a way of thinking, the choice of lifestyle. Art is a way of exchange through visual expression. This is how artists exist. Whatever media you're using, the most important is your ability to govern the media and whether your language by itself can present a personality. Artists like Lucian Freud and Eric Fischl were able to create a new language of painting on the traditional, 2-dimensional canvas. They were real geniuses. I don't have the ability to create a new language of painting, so it's only natural that I try
new forms of media. I think contemporary Chinese paintings have gained international popularity simply by being "Chinese" and carrying a "Chinese" image. It's nothing about the personal language of painting.
Fu: You received a huge amount of information when living abroad. While artists attempt to create various forms of works, it's almost inevidable that the internality of some works is similar to that of others. Do you take such similarity into consideration when you work?
Wang: In a broader context, similarity is unavoidable. We all live in this contemporary world. If we happen to care about similar subjects, be it social or visual, then our works could be quite similar. Living in the same age, we eat, wear, and use similar things. For example, red in today's world symbolizes alert. But 100 years ago, red was the color of celebration. The visual similiarity is created by the scope of language and association. Secondly, every person is a different individual. No two people have exactly the same personality. So when the work is yours, it is different from others. The works you've done in your lifetime can be lined up as a visual language to show your personal perspective. How can anyone copy that? Sometimes one particular piece may be similar to the work of another artist. But you must look at the relationship of the piece with the anterior and posterior works; they are related to one another. If a person doesn't create anything original but only copies others' works, then we can't say he has a similar style as other artists, because he is only imitating their styles.
Fu: An artist must create a connection for his works and establish a complete system of methodology. What is your system and methodology? Many of your works are about cultural identity. How can Eastern and Western cultures merge or interact before their relationship is discussed?
Wang: To understand an artist, we must look at a time period of years or decades. Many artists, including me, I focus on a subject during one period of time, but in another place and time, such focus changes. Identity and cultural issues had the greatest impact on me when I was in the USA. Being a Chinese, you're reminded every day that you don't belong to the mainstream culture. You're an outsider and your identity is an issue. Many of my works gradually merged with one another due to cultural factors. When I returned to China in 1995, my focus shifted from identity to social culture.
Fu: Since you returned to Beijing, the subjects of your works have become more about daily life. You turn daily experiences into works, which is different from what you did in the USA.
Wang: Why did I leave the USA and return to China? At that time, for an Asian artist in the USA to be heard, identity issue was the only way. So you are pushed to a corner where you can only talk about identity, that is, multiple identities or transformation of identity in post-modernism. On the other hand, local artists in the USA do not have an identity issue. Besides, foreign artists are not able to discuss social issues as incisively as local artists.
Fu: So it's about a limited right to speak.
Wang: To survive and create art in New York, you are always squeezed to the extent of deformation. Since I came back, I've found a very open space. I've returned to the mainstream. I don't belong to the minority anymore. Now I can work on the most ordinary subjects, from day-to-day life to political changes. The messages and image information I need can all be put into my art. I became very excited and ecstatic. During the transitional period, sometimes the amount of information was too big. China is going through a trememdous change and that has stimulated my mind. Such a change can no longer be seen in the West. The biggest problem in the West is boredom. Nothing changes. So their artists work meticulously on small variations. Of course their works are very sophisticated, but they can be quite boring. Even the artists themselves feel bored.
Fu: Have any of your works been similar to the works of others, by accident?
Wang: I can't say there has. But sometimes it's inevitable to have similar visual effects or subjects of concern. I've tried to avoid that or divorce myself from. I've increased the amount of information in my works. I've focused more on daily life. Even a very simple piece of work can contain a large amount of information. But many artists confine themselves in the cultural, intellectual, or philosophical circle. In my opinion, a good piece of work needs to be understood by the general public. So in 2000, I began working on Karaoke. Karaoke singing is a popular phenomenon. I wanted my work to carry information and to reflect a popular form of entertainment. I've realized that even in pursuit of a pure academic work, I still want to bring in realistic social information. The public has the right to appreciate your works, too. When you sing in a karaoke, you follow the lyrics. I didn't use a real song. I thought "ah" was enough, because the sound is the simplest element in a song. Karaoke has become the extreme form of popular culture in China. Everyone sings karaoke, but only those with a cultural mind will think deeper. It's about controlling and being controlled. Karaoke itself is a model for people to follow when singing songs, while singing should be a free expression. The singing voice comes not from the big mouth, but from the little people on the teeth. When the mouth shuts, the little people are silenced. The layered discussion is about controlling and being controlled, imitating and being imitated.
Fu: Is it also about individual and power?
Wang: At a higher level, it is about power. Who controls who? Which is power itself? It's like a loop. I always try to find a popular subject for the viewer. "The amateurs appreciate the outside, but the professionals appreciate the inside." Culture should be more open to the public, not centralized by a small group.
Fu: On the screen of "Always Welcome", the stone lion becomes a real pet. It has added a lot of humor, while maintaining the lion's original function and symbolism.
Wang: An art work should not be too difficult to understand. Everyone has their own interpretation when looking at an art work in a cultural context. Traditionally, lions are a symbol of cultural power. They used to be put in front of governm
By Fu Xiaodong
Fu Xiaodong (Fu): You began working on media art two years after you arrived in the USA. Such a change can be seen as a drastic contrast to your previous academic training. What was the process of the change?
Wang Gongxin (Wang): It was a change of the state of mind and lifestyle and was quite complex. When I went to the USA in 1998, I was a visiting scholar of realistic painting. The culture shock triggered the change, and I went through a period of self-subversion and self-denial for about 2 to 3 years. Everything started from zero again. But thanks to my techniques of realistic painting, I was able to survive in the USA. What influenced me the most was a way of thinking, the choice of lifestyle. Art is a way of exchange through visual expression. This is how artists exist. Whatever media you're using, the most important is your ability to govern the media and whether your language by itself can present a personality. Artists like Lucian Freud and Eric Fischl were able to create a new language of painting on the traditional, 2-dimensional canvas. They were real geniuses. I don't have the ability to create a new language of painting, so it's only natural that I try
new forms of media. I think contemporary Chinese paintings have gained international popularity simply by being "Chinese" and carrying a "Chinese" image. It's nothing about the personal language of painting.
Fu: You received a huge amount of information when living abroad. While artists attempt to create various forms of works, it's almost inevidable that the internality of some works is similar to that of others. Do you take such similarity into consideration when you work?
Wang: In a broader context, similarity is unavoidable. We all live in this contemporary world. If we happen to care about similar subjects, be it social or visual, then our works could be quite similar. Living in the same age, we eat, wear, and use similar things. For example, red in today's world symbolizes alert. But 100 years ago, red was the color of celebration. The visual similiarity is created by the scope of language and association. Secondly, every person is a different individual. No two people have exactly the same personality. So when the work is yours, it is different from others. The works you've done in your lifetime can be lined up as a visual language to show your personal perspective. How can anyone copy that? Sometimes one particular piece may be similar to the work of another artist. But you must look at the relationship of the piece with the anterior and posterior works; they are related to one another. If a person doesn't create anything original but only copies others' works, then we can't say he has a similar style as other artists, because he is only imitating their styles.
Fu: An artist must create a connection for his works and establish a complete system of methodology. What is your system and methodology? Many of your works are about cultural identity. How can Eastern and Western cultures merge or interact before their relationship is discussed?
Wang: To understand an artist, we must look at a time period of years or decades. Many artists, including me, I focus on a subject during one period of time, but in another place and time, such focus changes. Identity and cultural issues had the greatest impact on me when I was in the USA. Being a Chinese, you're reminded every day that you don't belong to the mainstream culture. You're an outsider and your identity is an issue. Many of my works gradually merged with one another due to cultural factors. When I returned to China in 1995, my focus shifted from identity to social culture.
Fu: Since you returned to Beijing, the subjects of your works have become more about daily life. You turn daily experiences into works, which is different from what you did in the USA.
Wang: Why did I leave the USA and return to China? At that time, for an Asian artist in the USA to be heard, identity issue was the only way. So you are pushed to a corner where you can only talk about identity, that is, multiple identities or transformation of identity in post-modernism. On the other hand, local artists in the USA do not have an identity issue. Besides, foreign artists are not able to discuss social issues as incisively as local artists.
Fu: So it's about a limited right to speak.
Wang: To survive and create art in New York, you are always squeezed to the extent of deformation. Since I came back, I've found a very open space. I've returned to the mainstream. I don't belong to the minority anymore. Now I can work on the most ordinary subjects, from day-to-day life to political changes. The messages and image information I need can all be put into my art. I became very excited and ecstatic. During the transitional period, sometimes the amount of information was too big. China is going through a trememdous change and that has stimulated my mind. Such a change can no longer be seen in the West. The biggest problem in the West is boredom. Nothing changes. So their artists work meticulously on small variations. Of course their works are very sophisticated, but they can be quite boring. Even the artists themselves feel bored.
Fu: Have any of your works been similar to the works of others, by accident?
Wang: I can't say there has. But sometimes it's inevitable to have similar visual effects or subjects of concern. I've tried to avoid that or divorce myself from. I've increased the amount of information in my works. I've focused more on daily life. Even a very simple piece of work can contain a large amount of information. But many artists confine themselves in the cultural, intellectual, or philosophical circle. In my opinion, a good piece of work needs to be understood by the general public. So in 2000, I began working on Karaoke. Karaoke singing is a popular phenomenon. I wanted my work to carry information and to reflect a popular form of entertainment. I've realized that even in pursuit of a pure academic work, I still want to bring in realistic social information. The public has the right to appreciate your works, too. When you sing in a karaoke, you follow the lyrics. I didn't use a real song. I thought "ah" was enough, because the sound is the simplest element in a song. Karaoke has become the extreme form of popular culture in China. Everyone sings karaoke, but only those with a cultural mind will think deeper. It's about controlling and being controlled. Karaoke itself is a model for people to follow when singing songs, while singing should be a free expression. The singing voice comes not from the big mouth, but from the little people on the teeth. When the mouth shuts, the little people are silenced. The layered discussion is about controlling and being controlled, imitating and being imitated.
Fu: Is it also about individual and power?
Wang: At a higher level, it is about power. Who controls who? Which is power itself? It's like a loop. I always try to find a popular subject for the viewer. "The amateurs appreciate the outside, but the professionals appreciate the inside." Culture should be more open to the public, not centralized by a small group.
Fu: On the screen of "Always Welcome", the stone lion becomes a real pet. It has added a lot of humor, while maintaining the lion's original function and symbolism.
Wang: An art work should not be too difficult to understand. Everyone has their own interpretation when looking at an art work in a cultural context. Traditionally, lions are a symbol of cultural power. They used to be put in front of governm
